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Andrew
Jun 29, 2004 16:22:15 GMT
Post by Joss on Jun 29, 2004 16:22:15 GMT
Drew's right guys, until Doyle comes back and gives us a final word on this we arre pretty much running around in circles here.
I like both of the previous two ideas. I think that I like Drew's a little more because it just seems more natural, more adequate.
Andrew bi? That's a somewhat disturbing thought. I was one of the few persons that actually liked to see the guy score with some babes back in "The Girl in Question". Never much liked the gay angle.
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Andrew
Jun 29, 2004 20:43:02 GMT
Post by LizaP on Jun 29, 2004 20:43:02 GMT
The problem with Andrew falling for a slayer in training is, frankly, Andrew is a total and complete geek where it comes to girls, even though he's 82% more manly. There is no history of him being attracted to women, and the only time we ever see him even look like he knows he's a guy is in the one episode where he's trying to convince Angel & Spike that he's moved on.
If you are totally in bed with the idea of him falling for a slayer in training, make the slayer really masculine. Andrew is turned on by strength, if you recall. I think that's one of the reasons he thinks Spike is so hot.
Well, that, and because Spike IS hot.
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chris
Champion
Posts: 124
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Andrew
Jun 29, 2004 22:54:55 GMT
Post by chris on Jun 29, 2004 22:54:55 GMT
I always thought Andrew was gay. When he went off with the women in season 5 it kinda threw that one but still not so sure...
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Andrew
Jun 30, 2004 0:33:49 GMT
Post by Joss on Jun 30, 2004 0:33:49 GMT
Okay guys, it is Doyle who is writting this episode.
Here's what he has to say:
1) Why would Buffy send Andrew in by himself?
a) She wouldnt. Andrew is working alone and Buffy has no idea what happened to him until Angel gives her a ring to find out the story.
2) Why is Andrew working alone, he's not a fighter.
a) no, he's not, but he's trying. This is how he thinks he can prove his worth, by taking on a role he isn't really fit for. This is where the Wesley -rogue demon hunter comparisons fit in. Andrew thinks with his knowledge of the arcane and his experience with the Slayers that he can strike off on his own....he can't, its just another bit a of a delusion to himself.
Keep in mind, my episode title is "roleplay" for a reason. The theme is about taking on others roles, trying to replace them. Such as Andrew taking on the role of champion/fighter....and failing. There is a scene when Angel needs some bookwork that illy turns into Fred -trying to fill the role needed- and is quickly scolded for it. Spike tries to step in and watch over Illy, to fill in for the deceasd Wesley, and that doesnt work either.
Also, to get really anal about it, Andrew can fight a little as seen in Chosen.
3) Why would Angel take him in?
A) because he needs somebody booksmart on his team. Also, as a favor to Buffy, to watch over Andrew. Andrew's great flaw is that he is a follower and easily susceptable to "going with the flow" so its best to make sure he doesnt fall in with the wrong crowd. He is a fairly dangerous character really.
4) Why is Andrew striking off on his own anyway?
a) The easy way out is to say he got a slayer killed. But that seems incredibly lame. I figured as I was writing something would hit me that I could use. I never thought it would be a major plot point, so I kinda figured there wouldnt be major discussion on it, unless we brought it back in a big way. Either way, it needs to be ambiguous in this particular episode, so as long as we have a vague idea that something bad went down, it shouldnt interfere with the writing on this particular episode.
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Dismas
Vampire with a Soul
Posts: 97
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Andrew
Jun 30, 2004 3:10:01 GMT
Post by Dismas on Jun 30, 2004 3:10:01 GMT
To reply to the questions in sum,
The tidbits we learned about the Scoobies in Angel-S5 placed them all over the world. When Giles told Angel he'd send his "best man" I believed what Giles meant was "his only man on the continent." It's not like Buffy or Giles want to trust Andrew with big responsibility, but the core group is spread pretty thin. He was in Rome last we saw, but Buffy and Dawn were probably looking hard for an excuse to kick him out. Why do you think they were never at the apartment?? Thus Andrew gets shipped back to the states.
Still, Andrew's developing and he must have earned a little trust and respect. Suppose the gang learns of a new girl living in California. Protocol dictates Andrew makes contact and puts her on plane to Europe. But since Andrew's been doing well lately, Giles says that he can train this one girl totally on his own. We could start the episode with Andrew playing the role of Giles tutoring Buffy in the graveyard as she fights a vamp. Result are tragic, of course.
Why does Angel take him in? That's a harder question. They're in similar situations if they both got people killed while they were leading them. Maybe Andrew just needs a place to stay, and tries to help out.
To go along with the roleplay theme, how about mid-episode Andrew tries to overcome his emotions to become a warrior-avenger? He's totally unsuited for the part, so it should be an amusing failure.
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Andrew
Jun 30, 2004 3:14:23 GMT
Post by Joss on Jun 30, 2004 3:14:23 GMT
Okay, I agree with what Dismas said about Andrew getting a job teaching a slayer in California. I like that idea.
And I also believe that we should now focus on Why does he stick around. We have a decent reason for him to show up, but why does he remain in LA? Does Giles and Buffy place him there as a spy on Angel? To make sure that he's okay or something?
I dunno.
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Dismas
Vampire with a Soul
Posts: 97
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Andrew
Jun 30, 2004 4:01:02 GMT
Post by Dismas on Jun 30, 2004 4:01:02 GMT
Someone suggested that Andrew THINKS he's supposed to spy on Angel, but it's more like Giles just wanted to give him something to do.
What will Fred think of him? "Wesley, Charles, and Lorne are gone and the best replacement you could find was this kid?"
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Andrew
Jun 30, 2004 19:24:53 GMT
Post by Doyle on Jun 30, 2004 19:24:53 GMT
There is no history of him being attracted to women, and the only time we ever see him even look like he knows he's a guy is in the one episode where he's trying to convince Angel & Spike that he's moved on. Actually, that's not quite true. In Buffy S6, there are plenty of examples of Andrew's heterosexuality. But then again, I could have said the same thing about Willow in S1-S3.
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Andrew
Jun 30, 2004 19:42:38 GMT
Post by Doyle on Jun 30, 2004 19:42:38 GMT
With the exception of the specifics of what I'm doing with Angel (which is reliant on whatever Drew does in Ep. 1), or assigning a Monster of the Week as antagonist, this episode and the character specific arcs (and most details thereof) have already been worked out. More discussion at this point is going to involve rewriting/rethinking the structure I've already planned and thus setting back production.
The idea of attaching Andrew to a slayer in some fashion is a complete 180 to what we had already established: no slayers. I believe its in the established ideas thread already, and been there for a while.
The only thing about Andrew that still needs to be decided is why he left Buffy & co. in the first place and honestly, it's not the most important thing for this particular episode as it wouldnt be revealed yet and any mention would be extremely vague. All the other stuff (why he's there, why he stays, etc.) is stated above, albeit loosely detailed; but essentially there.
Honestly, I think discussion on this episode is unecessary at this point. It's got a lot of work on it already and a writer in place to finish it off. We have some episodes (4-6) that are being neglected and if its our goal to release these in a timely fashion. i.e. one after the other on a weekly basis, then we need to get working on those episodes and work them up to a point that a writer can come in and finish them off. September is fast approaching.
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Andrew
Jul 20, 2004 22:36:28 GMT
Post by Drew on Jul 20, 2004 22:36:28 GMT
Yo, people! What's Andrew's arc this season?
He's showing up mysteriously, acting out the part of someone who can fight on their own. But really, he's a follower - almost dangerously.
By the end of the season he should be more competant - or should he self-destruct?
Ideas?
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Andrew
Jul 20, 2004 23:37:21 GMT
Post by Joss on Jul 20, 2004 23:37:21 GMT
MAJOR FREAKIN' SPOILERS 1
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Illyira and Fred are already self-destructing. so I would go with the more competent thing.
Maybe in the end he could go from 80% more manly to 7500%. He could go from being the dork to being someone like Giles.
Dunno, just posting stuff.
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Andrew
Jul 21, 2004 6:42:23 GMT
Post by LizaP on Jul 21, 2004 6:42:23 GMT
Actually, having Andrew become more like Giles makes sense to me.
He's shown he's responsible and can think for himself, but he needs a lot of guidance at this point. If you think back to how Wesley was in season 1 and how he progressed, I see no reason why Andrew can't have the same kind of progression. His purpose could be to learn as much as he can about the Powers, and I think he'd be pretty good at that. He's not stupid, he's just a little nelly geek. Give him a purpose and I think he would blossom.
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Andrew
Aug 27, 2004 15:48:34 GMT
Post by angelicslayer on Aug 27, 2004 15:48:34 GMT
i agree with LizaP. andrew isa little dorky but, he does need guidance. like wesley, andrew could grow from the dork from the evil trio into the tough fighter he always never thought he could be. about the slayer thing..... it's a good idea ,but the show is a lot better without any slayers involved. i do agree with whole slayer thing because andrew is watcher in-training. this is all getting very confusing.
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Andrew
Aug 27, 2004 19:39:06 GMT
Post by Inyan on Aug 27, 2004 19:39:06 GMT
There is not really a Slayer involved at all. It is some sort of accident that brings Andrew to LA ( We were thinking the death of his charge ). We never actually see the accident ( As far as i know ) so no slayer will ever be shown.
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Andrew
Aug 27, 2004 20:00:17 GMT
Post by Doyle on Aug 27, 2004 20:00:17 GMT
There is not really a Slayer involved at all. It is some sort of accident that brings Andrew to LA ( We were thinking the death of his charge ). We never actually see the accident ( As far as i know ) so no slayer will ever be shown. Actually, no. I decided that was a pretty lame excuse to (1) get him to L.A. and then (2) keep him there. I think what I came up with (tis a secret to all but Joss and Drew -- I like surprises, don't you?) makes a lot more sense. It also opens the door to explore Andrew's character in a semi new light without trying to reinvent the character and that's what I love about these shows, the characters change, evolve, but are still themselves. Joss has very 3 dimensional characters and the way it works is that, like real people, they surprise you. I think Andrew will. If Joss and LizaP use my treatment for ep. 3, Roger definitely will. And of course....Tobit will....well if you werent already "in the know that is" lol
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Stingray
Vampire
I was at Woodstock. I fed off a flower person and I spent six hours watching my hand move.
Posts: 29
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Andrew
Sept 4, 2004 17:44:11 GMT
Post by Stingray on Sept 4, 2004 17:44:11 GMT
Ok, Ok, I've got it. ;D. Andrew shows up, and annoyes Spike for about three days straight. Spike finally gets fed up, and twists the annoying little turd's head clean off. :o ;D 8-)
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Andrew
Sept 5, 2004 10:01:08 GMT
Post by Inyan on Sept 5, 2004 10:01:08 GMT
Um....no actually.
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