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Post by Drew on Dec 18, 2004 19:20:40 GMT
Episode 10 of our season will be "The Lost Boys".
It will be about a gang of vampire children. Possibly Spike has some kind of old connection to them.
Really, though, this episode should be about the lost boys of our show: Angel, Spike, Andrew, and Illyria (who was a King, right?).
Angel is going through the motions of atonement. He doesn't really have anything to look forward to anymore now that he's given up Shanshu.
Also, why is Andrew still hanging around? His brother is dead. We must come up with a reason for him to stay and not return to the Slayers.
And what are the repurcussions for Illyria now that Fred is out of her? This matter may be covered in Ep. 9, but it's worth discussing here, too.
So those are big matters for this ep, in my opinion. Other things:
How old are these vampire children? Very young? If so, what does that mean?
Teenagers? What would that mean? Perhaps it would signify a critical stage in development - a juncture point, really. As teenagers, they were on the verge of changing, of becoming something, but that was taken from them once they were sired. Could parallel Angel and Andrew.
Maybe Spike sired all of them - this possibility was discussed in the Lost Boys thread in the Scrapbook. See that thread for additional info.
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Everlong
Champion
Producer
Great and grand creator of Raven the series
Posts: 124
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Post by Everlong on Dec 18, 2004 19:53:10 GMT
Does Andrew have an attachment to Spike? Maybe sees him as a sort of surrogate older brother, especially after there experiences in Buffy season 7 and this season so far (i'm thinking of "They Live By Night"). Just a thought.
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Post by Inyan on Dec 20, 2004 11:19:32 GMT
(i'm thinking of "They Live By Night") The idea of family plays a huge part in that ep. And i vote really young vamps, 8 - 10 year olds. Why? Listen to Bills speach about kids and death at the end of Kill Bill 2. Thats Why! |
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Post by ThePowersThatBe on Dec 20, 2004 16:25:30 GMT
ooooh yeah, I forgot all about that one
Yeah, I agree... young children with adult minds is just a creepy concept all around, and something which really hasn't been done in the Whedonverse (Annointed One notwishstanding).
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Everlong
Champion
Producer
Great and grand creator of Raven the series
Posts: 124
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Post by Everlong on Dec 20, 2004 16:28:16 GMT
Yeah. It can be really freaky if done right.
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Post by Inyan on Dec 20, 2004 17:25:43 GMT
The "annoying one" wasnt creepy at all. That whole story line was the lowest point of buffy for me. It was just sooooooo lame.
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Post by Drew on Dec 20, 2004 17:35:59 GMT
I don't know Bill's speech. What does he say?
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Post by Inyan on Dec 20, 2004 17:45:26 GMT
He basically says that kids will do things just to see what will happen - even stomp on a fish flapping about on the floor. They dont really have concrete ideas of Life and Death formed yet, or good and evil for that matter. Have you not seen Kill Bill vol 2 Drew. If you havent im gonna have to stop talking to you.  |
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Post by Drew on Dec 20, 2004 17:49:15 GMT
I have seen it twice and it is one of my favorite films ever. I can't actually put into words how much I love those two movies. Can't wait until they actually come out with a decent DVD set of them - not to mention the complete soundtracks.
As for making the vamps kids, how does this idea of these kids doing evil things just to see what happens tie into the stories and emotions of our main characters?
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Post by Inyan on Dec 20, 2004 17:58:22 GMT
Well that is kinda how Angel and Spike were as evil vamps. They didnt even have their age to hide behind...
That gives me an idea. lets make these kids so "grown up" and mature that they make Angel and Spike, with their constant bickering, seem like the kids in comparison. These kids should be a well oiled machine that totally rip through team angel the first few times they meet.
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Post by ThePowersThatBe on Dec 20, 2004 18:05:28 GMT
Actually not a bad idea. When you think about it, Spike and Angel have been off their game since getting souls, not unlike lost children. To be confronted with someone who is truly as nasty as they were, or moreso... that could be interesting...  |
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Post by Drew on Dec 20, 2004 20:38:12 GMT
Actually not a bad idea. When you think about it, Spike and Angel have been off their game since getting souls, not unlike lost children. What does that mean? The stuff about soulless Angel and Spike being really evil and the kids being evil is all fine and valid, but we want to deal with new things for these two characters (and Andrew) - things and emotions that are brought on by the events of this season. We can't just keep saying that they used to be evil so we'll have an episode with some guest characters that were evil like them so that they can feel guilty some more. Angel is in a particular place at this point in the season. He's settling into his job at the Shelter and he's just sort've following Tobit's and TPTB's orders without doing much thinking of his home. He's getting into a rut. His life will be like this forever - just helping the helpless, helping the helpless, helping the helpless...so he just gives into it. In fact, he's exactly the opposite of lost, really. He's found. He's so found to the point that there is no variety to his life anymore. He's got one set path until he dusts. |
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Post by Joss on Dec 21, 2004 5:20:40 GMT
In fact, he's exactly the opposite of lost, really. He's found. He's so found to the point that there is no variety to his life anymore. He's got one set path until he dusts. Maybe because of this the vampire children will be stronger than him. By this point Angel will be kind of mechanic, doing things just because they are put in front of him, because he is going to be "redeeming" himself for all of eternity. the vampire kids on the other hands will be creatures that have no place, no purpose. They fight, they do all of this tuff, just to keep on existing, just to have a purpose. They do those evil things because they are trying to feel something. Angel doesn't even feel anything anymore. He really just doesn't care. He might even begin to see victims, murders, evil acts simply as statistics, just another form for him to fill out. He's like a file clerk. He goes out to save people, to help people because there's stuff waiting for him when he gets in in the morning. But the kids they fight because they have a passion inside of them. They're like Angel (pre-Tobit) evil version. They have a much better reason to going out and doing their stuff than Angel does for going out and saving people ... demons... whatever. Just a thought. Rip it to shreds. |
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Post by Drew on Dec 24, 2004 17:17:18 GMT
That could maybe work.
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Post by Drew on Dec 27, 2004 21:32:34 GMT
I just remembered that in this episode and possibly the next Angel and the others will really have Illyria on a tight leash. She and Fred are mortally linked. If anything happens to Illyria, it'll happen to Fred. I'm guessing Illyria won't be too happy about this.
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Post by Drew on Jan 2, 2005 22:01:07 GMT
Had an idea for the vampire children that will give us a great guest-appearance opportunity:
Drusilla always had a strange obsession with children. So she sired all of these kids sometime during the 20th century. She loved them like a mummie. After awhile, they got on Spike's nerves. He tried to kill them. Maybe he thinks he succeeded.
And be sure to see my previous post about Illyria.
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Post by Inyan on Jan 4, 2005 10:32:10 GMT
That would work so perfectly.
Great idea Drew.
;D
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Post by Drew on Jan 14, 2005 2:43:15 GMT
Just another vague idea:
Act 3 break is the re-appearance of Drusilla (until this point in the ep, she had only been in flashbacks). She arrives and relishes being united with her children. Then she kills them all somehow.
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Post by Joss on Jan 14, 2005 2:50:29 GMT
Maybe she kills them in the same way that Spike tried to kill them before but failed?
I think that it'll be interesting to explore just how huge is the bulk of trauma that these guys are carrying around. First they're killed as children, they're child vampires, their "stepdad" hates them all and treats them like scum, said "stepdad" tries to kill them (probably in some horrible Spike way [TM]) but fails. Not to mention that they're Dru's children. And trust me, it can't be a good thing to have her as a "mummie".
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Post by Inyan on Jan 24, 2005 15:05:38 GMT
As for Dru's appearnce, I've had a bit of a weird idea.
In a stable world Dru is chaotic/insane. What if the growing chaos has actually cancelled out Dru's chaos and she has become marginally saner?
Now im not saying that she would be the poster child for mental health but it would be a new and strange thing if she was at least lucid
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