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Post by Joss on Aug 29, 2004 21:51:36 GMT
NO, I MUST HAVE cOMPLETE CONTROL.
Okay, good point. I'll leave it open for a few more months and see what happens.
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Post by Doyle on Aug 30, 2004 1:39:28 GMT
LOL Man, we just had this talk about not planning out the whole season this early. Apparently, I don't leave much of an impression. Anyway, I'll say again for the general masses ears: when the episodes go "live' , attention will be shed on the site and we'll have an influx of new talent who will bring new ideas to the fold and some will surely be better than what we already have just like some will be worse. Even ME don't plot out every single episode at the beginning of the season.
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Post by Jaxxson on Aug 30, 2004 13:05:07 GMT
I'am not saying leave it open so we can figure out the whole season now type thing but if we leave it open then people can put ideas now and then pick them later
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Post by Joss on Aug 30, 2004 22:02:40 GMT
lol, it was just an idea. Don't worry, you changed my minds. It's cool. I won't close this thread. I just sometimes have the urge to do crazy shit. When you notice this happening please stop me, k? lol
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Post by Jaxxson on Sept 1, 2004 5:52:39 GMT
alright will do
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Everlong
Champion
Producer
Great and grand creator of Raven the series
Posts: 124
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Post by Everlong on Sept 2, 2004 19:19:08 GMT
Hey all. I know I haven't been posting enough. I'm probably gonna get booted off soon. Before then I came up with an idea. See what you think. I tried to be as descriptive as possible but I left it vaque enough for you to tweek it if you wish.
Addiction
There is a species of demon who can create powerful mental projections (His/her powers are similar to Jason 142 from X-Men 2). This demon (For sake of argument I'll refer to it as him.) prays on people and demons alike giving them the chance to live out their hearts fondest wish. They can be a rock star, a famous sportsman or even experience the love of a family that they never had. However the demon doesn't do this out of the kindness of his heart obviously. He only gives them a taste. To get more they have to do things for him.
Now one of the demon shelter regulars just happens to be one of his 'clients'. He/she begins to act like the title suggests - like an addict looking for a fix. Since this en-souled demon is normally rather passive the Fang Gang figure something is up and swing into action.
Of course the anti-drug message is there. But the real hook for this episode would be that at some point Angel and the gang get caught up in their own personal fantasies. It would be interesting to see the fondest desire of Angel, Spike and co.
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Post by Doyle on Sept 2, 2004 19:52:42 GMT
Tentative Title: "The New Guy"
Angel and Spike come across an old vamp aquaintance of theirs (thus giving us room to do some flashbacks -something missing from this season thus far) but the first twist is the vamp is on their side and the second twist is that he would appear to have a soul. (don't worry, its not what it seems, its just for some fun interaction with Spike and Angel not feeling special anymore as they are constantly outdone by "the new guy").
Anyway as the plot progresses, it turns out this guy isnt all that heroic and in reality his "soul" is just a glamour to fool demons and his real agenda has been to assassinate Tobit all along. Of course this if foiled by our heroes.
Now, why would he try to assassinate ole Wash? Because, the other side -although quite weak in this realm- do still exist and realize the balance of power has shifted and are getting desperate to try and level the field a bit. The irony being that Angel & Co. stop the evil menace from killing Tobit who in turn will try to kill them.
The new guy being a vamp is completely open for debate, I just thought it would give us an opening to explore Spike and Angel's past together again with another characters somewhat like The Immortal - someone better. However, it can easily be replaced with some kind of generic demon.
Discuss?
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Post by Inyan on Sept 2, 2004 19:53:34 GMT
AddictionThere is a species of demon who can create powerful mental projections (His/her powers are similar to Jason 142 from X-Men 2). This demon (For sake of argument I'll refer to it as him.) prays on people and demons alike giving them the chance to live out their hearts fondest wish. They can be a rock star, a famous sportsman or even experience the love of a family that they never had. However the demon doesn't do this out of the kindness of his heart obviously. He only gives them a taste. To get more they have to do things for him. Now one of the demon shelter regulars just happens to be one of his 'clients'. He/she begins to act like the title suggests - like an addict looking for a fix. Since this en-souled demon is normally rather passive the Fang Gang figure something is up and swing into action. Of course the anti-drug message is there. But the real hook for this episode would be that at some point Angel and the gang get caught up in their own personal fantasies. It would be interesting to see the fondest desire of Angel, Spike and co. I posted a similiar idea ages ago. Ive quoted it below. I like the idea of a fake reality and the dangers that it emposes. Norgat is a warlock that takes you biggest fear and makes you live through it. He then draws your emotional pain away and feeds it into a third party as intense pleasure, for which he gets quite hansomly paid I might add. While the gang is in the sewers looking for some demon, Norgat senses them, probes their mind and finds their fears. He likes what he sees and captures the gang. Angel fears that Conner still blames him for his weird-ass life. Spike fears that his soul is not pure enough to fight his demon side. Illyria fears that the memories of Fred will overpower her and destroy her. The gang must realise what is going on, break free of Norgats spell and kill him.
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Post by Joss on Sept 2, 2004 23:41:33 GMT
Okay, Inyna's idea I thought was good but for some reason we never really disucssed it. It was good. I think that maybe we could combine both of these ideas, have an episode that is constantly slipping into and out of fantasy, both good and bad fantasies.
The basic idea of The New Guy reminds me a bit of Somnambulist for some reason. Still I think that the idea is very interesting and has a lot of potential. The idea of someone who tries to assasinate Tobit is one that I had never really thought of, it might be very interesting. The only thing I feel needs to be compeltlty changed is the idea that this guy is somewhat better than Spike and Angel, it's too much like The Immortal. But having a character out of Angel and Spike's past come out is an interesting idea.
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Post by Doyle on Sept 3, 2004 0:45:24 GMT
The basic idea of The New Guy reminds me a bit of Somnambulist for some reason. Still I think that the idea is very interesting and has a lot of potential. The idea of someone who tries to assasinate Tobit is one that I had never really thought of, it might be very interesting. The only thing I feel needs to be compeltlty changed is the idea that this guy is somewhat better than Spike and Angel, it's too much like The Immortal. But having a character out of Angel and Spike's past come out is an interesting idea. You pretty much acknowledged all of my own doubts. It doesn't have to be a vampire, it'd just be nice to get back to basics a little. I def. agree that it could be played too similar to the immortal thing and although thats not exactly what I was thinking in my mind , I'll say just toss that bit and just do something that gives Angel and Spike a reason to bond over their mutual distaste for the guy. I think we really need another Angel/ Spike Buddy movie kinda episode and also get back to the roots of the show being about vampires complete with flashbacks for an episode.
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Post by Drew on Sept 3, 2004 17:20:04 GMT
I like Everlong and Inyan's ideas. I think they could be combined in some way. I'd like to steer clear of any kind of anti-drug message. Having them live out their greatest fantasies is something we don't see as often as characters living out their greatest fears so I might be more inclined to go that way. I kinda like the New Guy premis, too. I always wanted another member in the Order of Aurelius. I think that this new guy should want to kill Tobit for another reason, though, not just because he's a rep of the Powers.
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Post by Inyan on Sept 3, 2004 20:59:30 GMT
Maybe instead of a vampire or whatever it could be a preist.
My thinking is that it could be a preist from the same order that tortured Tobit. He's sort of gone rouge, learnt kick-ass magic and now he thinks he's doing God's will by kiling demons.
Tobit doesnt know him as he joined the order just after Tobit was expelled. He heard accounts of Tobits torture from some of the preist that were there at the time. This guy is a real zeolot and went ape-shit when he found out that they let Tobit go instead of killing him. He killed all the preists at the church as punishment for their "sins" and is now out to finish the job they started.
He originally approaches Tobit as an emisary from the church to appologise for what was done to him, but is actually just there for recon. This were he puts the gang into the "worst fear" hallucinations as a kind of purgatory.
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Post by Drew on Sept 3, 2004 23:33:25 GMT
Maybe the ep could take place after Tobit is in the Monastary and after TPTB come to him. And does it need to be a guy? Could Spike have turned a woman into a vamp? Male vampires prefer taking the women, after all. Could provide for some flashbacks with a jealous/ever-insane Drusilla as Spike brings home a new girl. Spike's love of Dru would probably be so powerful that he'd discard the new girl quickly. It'd be cool if these flashbacks w/ Spike, Dru, and new girl took place at some point in the 20th century, as we often don't get much of that (remember the few seconds of '50s Italy in "The Girl in Question").
Then after the new girl is discared she runs into Tobit in the 80s or 90s or something. And....you know.....shit happens....
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Post by LizaP on Sept 4, 2004 4:44:10 GMT
And....you know.....shit happens.... You mean, wackiness ensues? I'd love a flashback episode - like to the 1920's Jazz Era. I can totally see Dru in a beaded flapper dress.
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Post by Joss on Sept 4, 2004 15:34:17 GMT
Okay, here's my thoughts on The New Guy
I'm basically going to agree with much of what has been said before. Even if it only to make it less like Somnambulist we should have the vampire be a girl, it seems to make more sense for the reasons that Drew said. The flashbacks should probably be set in an era where it is just Dru and Spike, no Darla or Angel in the flashbacks. And defintelty in the 20th century, we haven't seen enough of those years.
So basically I agree with everything that you other people have said.
1920s-30s would be great.
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Post by Doyle on Sept 4, 2004 19:00:38 GMT
Okay, here's my thoughts on The New Guy I'm basically going to agree with much of what has been said before. Even if it only to make it less like Somnambulist we should have the vampire be a girl, it seems to make more sense for the reasons that Drew said. The flashbacks should probably be set in an era where it is just Dru and Spike, no Darla or Angel in the flashbacks. And defintelty in the 20th century, we haven't seen enough of those years. So basically I agree with everything that you other people have said. 1920s-30s would be great. You wan't to put a "twist" on it, so you make it a female? WTF? How many times we going to go down that road this season? See: "Demon Woman" thread. The sex of the vampire should be irrelevent. What's it matter if it's male or female? I don't think it's derivitive of somnambulist in the slightest. The only thing that my pitch had in common with that episode is a vampire from Angel and Spike's past arrives in L.A. . And a vampire in L.A. is not that uncommon. I never proposed it would be one that either of them had sired. That's a bit tired and cliche and definitely not my idea. Having the flashback revolve around Spike and Dru is completely missing the point of my proposal which was to (1) give Angel & Spike another "buddy" episode and (2) to get back to the basics of the show by using vampires and flashbacks.
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Post by Joss on Sept 4, 2004 21:42:58 GMT
Hmm, okay you are right we are having a lot of female characters turn out to be villains...
All right, so you do make some interesting points. I guess we all really did jump the gun a bit there and assume that it was one of them that sired them. Okay yeah, that is a bit cliche. We have never really seen two vampires that did not have a sire relationship team together, it might be interesting to do it like that.
Okay, now to the points that you said below. While it is true that having it be a vampire that only Spike and Dru knew will not allow it to be a Buddy Angel/Spike episode it would not interfeer with the second point. I twould still be about flashbacks with vampires with them... although since the show is called Angel it might be best if he is them.
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Post by Drew on Sept 4, 2004 22:18:06 GMT
Okay, now to the points that you said below. While it is true that having it be a vampire that only Spike and Dru knew will not allow it to be a Buddy Angel/Spike episode it would not interfeer with the second point. I twould still be about flashbacks with vampires with them... although since the show is called Angel it might be best if he is them. Would that mean we have to go back to that ever smaller time frame of the 1880s? Sorta getting sick of that era.
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Post by Joss on Sept 4, 2004 22:24:31 GMT
Yeah, that is true.... it has been done to death. I would much prefer to just have it be Dru and Spike, but that interfers with Doyle's original vison for this episode.
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Post by Doyle on Sept 4, 2004 22:46:46 GMT
Yeah, that is true.... it has been done to death. I would much prefer to just have it be Dru and Spike, but that interfers with Doyle's original vison for this episode. Just do as you like. I personally don't think ME would go for it, but it's your season and you should do what you feel is best. Would that mean we have to go back to that ever smaller time frame of the 1880s? Sorta getting sick of that era. You can always find ways to write around it, like they did in "Why we fight". All it takes is a little effort.
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